A case in point ...

[blamebrampton]

So, there we were, having a chat on a friend's LJ about the differences between the US and the UK for purposes of a self-Britpicking list, with participants from both sides of the pond and beyond and frequent diversions into baiting and comedy from all sides, and apparently it has become a source of Flocked Drama.

Consider the argument very carefully: At least one American is very upset that British people prefer to be depicted in accurate ways.

And if you can't see why that's a bit dodgy, replace the word British with any other nationality.

I don't want to overstate the case, because really, it doesn't culturally oppress us the way that some other cultures have been oppressed by this sort of thing, since we don't deeply care and we had an Empire first. And while the original source of the complaint is a preference, it's certainly not a sine qua non, and we read heaps of stuff that gets us wrong, and some of it is good and some is crap, and really, at the end of the day we still pronounce and spell aluminium in ways that are scientifically logical, which in itself is enough. But, honestly ...

Interestingly, one of my points of difference was a tendency to soap-opera-like over-reactions in fiction. Clearly I drew the line too narrowly.

AND I left off the fact that it the entire United States has been the subject of mass-brainwashing to accept caffeinated flavoured beverages as coffee. Though I see Starbucks has dropped the word from their logo, truth in advertising at last!

Comments

[vaginal-parfait.livejournal.com]

I'm not American or English, so culturally I can't really complain about Brit- picking or the lack of it. I'm Indian, and most of my knowledge of both cultures comes from books and movies and music and all sorts of other media. Basically, for me, it's one giant mish- mash, haha. I don't think I'd have a problem with a fic that used a few incongruous spellings, or had a detail or two that was out of place. But then again, I'm not British or American and most of the fanfiction I've read has tended to revolve around those two cultures.

Obviously, I'd click out of a fic that's rooted in some improbable, jarring detail-- or one that overtly ignored the world it's set in. But then again, if a fic is guilty of those things it's probably not a very good one to begin with, yeah?

As to the culture stereotypes and some of the views that people have been upset by, I think anybody'd be upset at their culture being portrayed in an unjustifiably negative/stereotyped/just plain ignorant way. And even if it's justifiable, (which it may very well be)-- well, it's like that old saw about family, isn't it? You're allowed to badmouth your parents but your friends aren't allowed to join in. It's just the way we are.

I think broad generalisations in fic or mainstream media or whatever are appreciated -or at the very least, tolerated- ninety percent of the time. But there's always the chance of someone getting upset because they may be the exception to those generalisations, or they may not see them in quite the same light. Even a CHARACTER making fair/unfair statements about one's country or having negative views of one's country can be incredibly off- putting. Have you read Naomi Novik's Temeraire, series? I loved the books, all the way until the fourth part, I think. The protagonist Lawrence, is by and large a sympathetic character. But he lives in the time of the British Empire and his ideologies are compatible with those of a British gentleman of the time. Which is perfectly all right, and actually completely accurate, considering the age in which the books are set-- but some of his views on the colonies actually made me put the book down and stop reading for a while. I think I expected him -as a sympathetic character who was against slavers and the like- to go against the grain a bit more than he did. It's completely irrational, but there you go. Patriotism, even the subconscious kind, is hard to shake off, I suppose.

This whole post has been really interesting! I mean, obviously, wankery abounds and all that, but from a purely academic perspective it's kinda cool to read everyone's thoughts on culture:)

[blamebrampton.livejournal.com]

I did find it deeply ironic that people who are prepared to go to the mat over perceived cultural slurs against their culture (which were in at least one case based on an all men are Socrates fallacy) are absolutely unwilling to grant that British people are allowed to be offended by exactly the same thing.

Still, at least it proves that we have successfully portrayed our stoicism as a virtue to the world!

The Temeraire books are great examples of awkwardness. hollyxu and I had a big chat about books 2 and 4, and I had a big laugh about book 6. I actually have some issues with his Regency Britishness, too, but overall the reader is inclined to go on because the story is strong. Bad writing can't keep a reader through a problem like that.

[vaginal-parfait.livejournal.com]

It took me about two days, but I continued on and I'm glad I did. They were REALLY well written, so that's something. Idk idk, all the not- so- subtle superiority coming off EVERY SINGLE BRITISH CHARACTER in ~waves~ pissed me off something rotten. It's super annoying when all these characters you LIKE and IDENTIFY WITH also act like supremacist dicks when it comes to every other country ever. The worst part was that it felt really one dimensional, you know? I mean I realise that there's this stereotype of the typical Empire Builder, but COME ON. It's not like they shared a hive mind. Almost all the history I did in high school included one chapter or the other about the British Raj in India, and there were any number of accounts about patriotic AND sympathetic English men and women, many of whom actually supported the independence movements in various colonies. I loved the books in every other regard, but I wish she'd fleshed out their political affiliations instead of just making them all mindless servants of the Empire.

Sorry, none of the above has any relevance to your post. I'll shut up now.