Someone must be good at chemistry ...

[blamebrampton]

Is there anyone out there who is genuinely good at chemistry? I have a writer who assures me that using Epsom salts in the bath will cut down on soap scum. This seems crazy to me, because the addition of magnesium to water will harden it, which I would think would lead to more, not less, scum. Am I secretly insane? Am I missing something? Is there a clever cunning trick that means the Epsom salts will harden the water but stop the scum sticking to the bath?

Is there any way of stopping journalists using internet gossip sites as their sole sources of information? Is there any way to make the internet more accurate? Is there any way I can be issued with a blanket immunity to prosecution for throwing things at journalists who say 'No, that's right, it was on the internet!'

Also ...
HAPPY BIRTHDAY marinelle24 ! I hope you have a lovely day!

Comments

[hogwartsvixxxen.livejournal.com]

Sis I have no idea but I did find this.

http://www.howtogetridofstuff.com/household/how-to-get-rid-of-soap-scum/

[blamebrampton.livejournal.com]

Cheers, dear! See that lot makes sense: the ammonia et al will cut through the fat that adheres the scum to the porcelain. The wax would stop it depositing in the first place. All logical. The Epsom salts, on the other hand ...

How's the mouth? I hope it's all healing up nicely without too many cups of salt water gargled! (bleagh!)

[hogwartsvixxxen.livejournal.com]

on a scale from 1-10 10 being the worse it went from 10,000 to about 5-51/2. Rinsing
and gargling with Brown Listerine (URGH!), warm salt water, and Hydrogen Peroxide. *hugs* Thanks for asking.

[blamebrampton.livejournal.com]

Oh you poor dear! I hope it's all better soon! There's little worse than tooth and mouth pain, especially when all the cures taste so horrid.

[hogwartsvixxxen.livejournal.com]

Sometimes the pain using the cures is worse than the original pain it's self. *palms face* Thaks for your well wishes Sis. *hugs*

Hope this helps!

[absynthedrinker.livejournal.com]

I asked my mother's housekeeper how she does it and she says she has used Epsom salts for years. That doesn't answer your chemistry question, but it verifies your friends contention.

http://www.thriftyfun.com/profile.ldml?profile=thr329634

http://www.ehow.com/how_2123412_keep-soap-scum-bathtubs.html

Peace,
Bubba

Re: Hope this helps!

[blamebrampton.livejournal.com]

Oh good grief ... now I am terribly confused.

Does she use it with the soap powder? It looks as though it contains a phosphate, which would interfere with the depositing of the scum on the bathtub surface, so that would make sense. Alone, and with soap, I can't see the mechanism it works my, which is not to say there isn't one!

I knew I should have spent more time paying attention to chemistry. It's like that terrible moment the other year when I did need to know the capital of Niger, and all that came to mind was the cranky voice of Mr Fitzpatrick telling me I'd regret not paying attention to that class some day ...

Re: Hope this helps!

[absynthedrinker.livejournal.com]

Yes she uses soap powder and she says that it leaves the tubs spotless!(and scumless)

Niamey dear and here is a photo of the Great Mosque there.


Peace,
Bubba

Re: Hope this helps!

[blamebrampton.livejournal.com]

Thanks, dear! On both counts. I have always been rubbish at western Africa, anything past Chad is a mystery to me.

Re: Hope this helps!

[absynthedrinker.livejournal.com]

Me too! I've spent time in Kenya with my aunt and once went to see the flowers of Namaqualand which is tecnically on the west coast but not Western Africa.

Sweet dreams darling.

Peace,
Bubba

[silvershinigami.livejournal.com]

'No, that's right, it was on the internet!'

I really, really wish you were joking. D:,' Didn't everyone learn in high school that the internet is full of lies??

[blamebrampton.livejournal.com]

Journalists have a strange love for it. The bastards.

[annes-stuff.livejournal.com]

I suspect they are just being lazy.

Why go to the library or call a reputable authority on anything when you can Google it or use wiki?

[libby-drew.livejournal.com]

Actually...I use epsom salts to cut down on soap scum. I have no idea how it works, it's like magic! ;-p

[blamebrampton.livejournal.com]

How do you use it? And is Mr Sansa a chemist so that I can understand how this works? I am willing to accept it might, but want a mechanism I can understand.

I think in a previous life I was an engineer or physicist ...

[libby-drew.livejournal.com]

Mr Sansa is an engineer, which means he thinks every problem in the world can be solved with a diagram.

Well, I don't clean with it, really. Every time I draw a bath for the kids, I add a little. Learned the trick from my mother-in-law. She said there's something about the salt that keeps the soap scum from attaching to the tub. It works. *shrug*

[potteresque_ire]

Heh, interesting question. I never used epsom salt for cleaning before.

If I have to venture a guess, I'd say it has something to do with ionic strength. It is definitely true that magnesium causes more scum to form—you're not insane at all!! But at the same time, the sulfate (SO4-) will be a continuous competitor for the magnesium ion, and the continuous exchange of the Mg2+ between the carboxylate (COO-) from the soap and the sulfate may help to increase the solubility of the precipitates in the water, which means in the end you have less left in the tub, but more in the pipes. Supposedly a bit of scum in the pipes is a good thing though as it protects the metal from corrosion :D

Am I making this all up? Maybe... *grins*

ETA: Once I wrote something in a forum ... a small opinion about something. The next day it was on the mainland China newspaper as a "news source". Oh, am I the only person who's really irked by the "I-report" on CNN.com? They call it unfiltered news .... I tend to be mean and think that they're lazy and/or trying to cut down their crew.

And my office mate insists that my best career option is to write for Onion.com. He says I totally have it. Should I take it as a praise or insult? :D

[noeon.livejournal.com]

Okay. That was awesome.

And your office mate is perhaps silly, but the writers for the Onion are really good. I believe Stewart and Colbert poached some of their staff from the Onion.

[noeon.livejournal.com]

Not a chemist. I did once do a chemistry project on soap scum, but it's been a long time.

Epsom salts do seem totally counterintuitive. The Germans use extra distilled vinegar for hard water residue in teakettles and waterheaters. That works beautifully but smells.

Perhaps the nature of the residue is also an issue. Sometimes it's calcium buildup and sometimes it's surfectants and other things from water processing.

[uminohikari.livejournal.com]

Well, if the salts form ions, maybe they will bind to other ions that form scum to form something that..doesn't form scum?

...that made more sense in my head

[who_la_hoop]

I know nothing about the epsom salts thing! I can't say my bath gets all that scummy... maybe I am just naturally extra clean and scum-free! :D

[meredyth-13.livejournal.com]

Um, you could try the faith deterrent - along the lines of 'Hey, if you believe everything you read on the internet is true, how about I inject you with cancer, and then we'll treat you ONLY with non traditional cures found ON THE INTERNET!' - I think you'll find that they either a) discover the benefits of proper research or b) the number of annoying journalists available will drop dramatically, and of those that do survive should be welcome to continue using the internet as their only source of information. :D

I guess it's just a new take on the Darwinian approach.

(please excuse any obvs spelling errors - I can't type, spell and cough at the same time)

[shu-shu-sleeps.livejournal.com]

offhand I can't think of how to get a blanket immunity from Battery charges - so I'd focus on setting up your defence.... automotism? self defence? insist that all future conversations be held on a basketball court while you practice your three point shots with them standing under the hoop?

[orions-stars.livejournal.com]

I'm not a chemist, so this is a layperson's best guess and explanation.

Epsom salt is magnesium sulfate, so when you add it to water you positively charged magnesium ions and the negatively charged sulfate ions. If you've got hard water, you've already got metal ions dissolved in it (like magnesium and calcium) that will react with your soaps and precipitate out of the solution. As I well know, since when I lived in southern California (home of hard water), we ended up with calcium carbonate and magnesium carbonate deposits (limescale).

My best guess for WHY the epsom salt would work is that you're adding a significant amount of sulfate anions to the water (epsom salts are highly soluble). You still have metal ions, but the overall solution becomes less electrolytically active, so there would be fewer metal ions "available" to react with your soap. However, this would be less effective if you've got really hard water, so people living in different areas could have pretty different results.

Epsom salts are added to baths a lot (they're in most bath salts, I think) and I know that ionizing the water can prevent you from "pruning" in the bath because your skin absorbs less water (therefore not something to do if you have dry skin). Other than that, I can't see why it would hurt to try it.